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Your other left
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Posted - Feb 25 2018 : 9:02AM
I suspect his brief was broader than 'stop a shooter'. However, the salient point is that we don't know that he took the job knowing he couldn't do it. If he did then he certainly does deserve all the slings and arrows.
 
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BOYCOTT JAMES DEEN - BOYCOTT COMPANIES THAT BOOK HIM OR SELL HIS WORK. YES, IT'S THAT BLACK & WHITE.
6939 Posts
8/15
Posted - Feb 25 2018 : 10:03AM
Interesting article:

Senior Member

2891 Posts
12/12
Posted - Feb 25 2018 : 10:25AM
This is a very poor equivalence. 99.9% of gun owners never shoot, let alone kill anyone. 100% of ppl who have abortions are by definition ending a form of life. Whether you consider it a human or just a clump of worthless cells, it is still an organic form of life. There is a diametrically opposed proportion of responsibility here. It's comparing virtually none (gun owners responsible for harm) to virtually all (those going through with abortion are responsible for either terminating or precluding the development of life).
Even fathoming this equivalence results in immediate backfire. It's just a really horrid comparison. They'd have been better off comparing purchase of condoms/birth control, which nobody really gets uppity about unless someone is arguing that tax dollars should go toward it. But nobody has cause to form mobs and shame ppl from using their own money to pick up a pack of trojans from CVS.
But to compare purchasing of a firearm to getting an abortion? This is resoundingly anti-intellectual and just flat out embarrassing. I am pro-choice, but I swear these activists are the most entitled and stupid folks on the planet. They actually push me toward sympathizing more with the pro-lifers who are borderline retarded.
Edited by - melvyn on 2/25/2018 10:41:06 AM

Senior Member

2891 Posts
12/12
Posted - Feb 25 2018 : 10:39AM
How quaint. Limitations based on the hour of the day. And look how wonderful the results have been. Still 10,000 ppl killed in alcohol related vehicular accidents every year. Licenses, locations, hours of sale - it's not stopping this. I know some people get upset when they can't buy wine before noon on Sunday in same places. But this isn't really having any significant impact on drunk driving.
With gun control, we don't often don't have hourly limitations/permission. We have 24/7 regulated "gun free zones." Wonderful idea. And let's be sure every school shooting to remind the population how impervious this defense is... which is not at all. Not in the slightest. These kids and faculty are sitting ducks. Nothing the gun-control advocates will even approach preventing these attacks.
All the media does is remind these sick fucks how easy it is to wreak havoc on schools.
Would any of this have prevented Parkland massacre? That deranged fucker went out of his way to be put on a watch list. 39 visits by police. Multiple notices to the FBI by other witnesses. He even posted that he wanted to do it.
Add to that the police standing down outside the school while shooting was happening... good grief. Arming all teachers is a terrible idea. But the only thing worse is ensuring that they have absolutely zero chance whatsoever, mandating that they be defenseless against such an attack. While police do nothing. While the FBI fuck off. Yeah I know they get inundated with thousands of tips every week. But almost none of them are as gift-wrapped open-and-shut as someone broadcasting to the world that they want to be a pro school shooter. Surely that should have elevated that particular tip to top priority.
There is no worse idea than the one that is in place, which renders kids and faculty sitting ducks. Why are these mass shootings seemingly more common? Who the fuck knows. But it's not that society is becoming more violent overall. It's not. Murder rates are less than half of what they were 25 years ago.
Do we have more or less gun regulation since Columbine? Have mass shootings become more or less common?
If it was as simple as "ban assault rifles" like so many think, it still wouldn't make a difference. Not even a 1% difference. Parkland shooter had a semi-auto. It wasn't even an assault rifle, never mind a machine gun. So go ahead and ban assault rifles. It makes zero statistical difference, but makes these grandstanding morons feel important. Parkland could have happened if he just had a bag of pistols. No one was going to stop him evidently. Hell it could have been even worse with just pistols. Look what happened at Virginia Tech. That psycho set a sickening record that lasted a decade with just pistols.
Anyhow, like I said before. I'm not against improving gun control. I'm just afraid it won't make any difference. System seems set up to fail time and time again. I bet 99% of the FBI is pissed as fuck at the less than 1% who were responsible for parsing the data of this particular case.
And this is the same country that suspends a kid who chewed a pop-tart into the shape of a gun. The hysteria is what's killing America. Too much time spent overreacting to bullshit. That's what bogs the system down. Bullshit.
All of this bitter bickering and dehumanizing (they called Dana Loesch a murderer, for fuck's sake; these people don't know the definition of murder. This similar ilk who called Darren Wilson a murderer without evidence), and for what? It won't make a 1% difference of 1%.
But they can carry on pretending to be getting at the root of the issue. It's cute.
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Senior Member

2891 Posts
12/12
Posted - Feb 25 2018 : 10:47AM
She's right. They get hard-ons for this kind of tragedy. This is what fuels news media. It actually also fuels the fantasies of gun nuts who dream of being a hero like the guy who used the AR-15 a few months ago and helped stop that church shooter in Texas. But how many of these gun nuts actually thrive or make a living off of such fantasies? How about 0%. By contrast, 100% of news media thrive off tragedies.

Senior Member

2891 Posts
12/12
Posted - Feb 25 2018 : 11:09AM
More interesting how the voices decrying the gov as oppressive and racist now want gov to be the only ones with guns... There's no wrapping your mind around this.

Senior Member

"In Defense of Rape and Incest" by Steve King
6995 Posts
11/13
Posted - Feb 25 2018 : 11:14AM
Let's break it down a wee bit, and then -- it's off topic and would need another thread.
I believe it was meant to be satire. Rather than actually advocating an ultrasound wand up the ass for gun purchasers, it was an insult to the lawmakers who legislate the ultrasound for women.
As a 40+ year vegetarian, I believe the 'clump of cells' is alive. But so are sheep and chickens and cows, and other people make choices that I don't make. It's not illegal to end an organic form of life.
I might remind you here, that one of our illustrious recent vice presidents shot a friend in the face. These things DO happen.
And then we veer off topic. 'Precluding the development of life' is also possible with a condom or the pill, so let's ignore that. As far as termination, I don't like abortion; nobody does. But I don't want people who don't want kids to be raising kids. Crack moms do not give their kids up for adoption, they raise them in hell. That's enough reason for me to think that if someone wants an abortion, it should be available.



Senior Member

2891 Posts
12/12
Posted - Feb 25 2018 : 11:28AM
This is a great case for not compelling every teacher to have a gun. That's a ridiculous idea. People who lack the confidence certainly shouldn't feel forced to.
"What if I (this)" "What if (that)" - right, and what if someone is gunning people down in your hall, he's right outside the door to your class and about the break in. You and your class are about to be wasted. But it's better that we made sure you had no chance at surviving, while armed police stand down outside because they aren't trapped and don't have to do nothin evidently. But you are trapped with scant minutes to do anything.
It's terrible that kids died trying to hold their doors shut to keep him out. I saw one black student was hit multiple times. One Asian ROTC student was killed also trying to hold the door. There's a petition to raise money to give him a full honors burial.
That police department is going to go through hell. Wouldn't be surprised if some of those cops are contemplating suicide. It's a terrible position when you don't know what you're up against. It's still terrible even when you do.

Senior Member

"In Defense of Rape and Incest" by Steve King
6995 Posts
11/13
Posted - Feb 25 2018 : 11:36AM
Ummm... yes. Yes indeed. Yes it most certainly could have prevented the massacre.
If we had a system that allowed you to deny gun purchases to mentally ill people with dozens of police calls.
We couldn't even get this:
While that piece of legislation might or might not have helped, the fact is that legislation can't even be put into effect which REQUIRES actual FULL DISABILITY BENFITS, AND -- someone to be SO DEBILITATED that they are unable to manage their own benefits and need a third party to do so.
So. There was a regulation that would have prevented gun sales to really, really, really disabled people who are even unable to manage cash that is automatically deposited.
And that was quashed.
So 'dozens of police calls' aren't even on the table. We are forbidden to consider it.
If you can't even put that into practice, then no amount of 'crazy' can be taken into account in denying the sale of a gun. There is no point in recording mental illness. It is prohibited to consider it at all. You can have any number of police reports, commitments to mental hospitals, padded rooms and straight jackets, drooling, whatever. You still have to give the guy a semi-automatic weapon.
As someone said the other day, every country has mentally disturbed people. Only the U.S. arms them.


Senior Member

2891 Posts
12/12
Posted - Feb 25 2018 : 12:02PM
No, by precluding the development of life I'm operating under the rather reasonable, if I may say, assumption that once an egg has been seeded, it's probably going to develop into a human life. That's not just one person jacking off and wasting seed that never meets egg, or a woman's natural cycle when she's not been impregnated. You can also similarly infer those events "preclusion of life developing" but I don't think it's comparable to unprotected sex without regard for impregnation which, unsurprisingly, results in impregnation. A guy nutting into a condom or a woman with at least the protection of birth control isn't the same as precluding life that is going to invariably develop by hosing an unprotected womb down with billions of sperm by deciding after gestation that it's time to "preclude" it. I think it's still generous to call it "precluding" when it's after the fact they've been made aware that gestation has begun. But sometimes I feel generous.
Given we're just talking past each other on this issue since we both seem to be pro-choice, let's just agree to disagree that it's a poor analogy, even if satirical. A satire is better when it's accurate and not sloppy IMO.
We can live in a world where we don't believe in shaming ppl who feel compelled to have an abortion, while also believing people don't need to be shamed for simply owning a gun. What people need to be ashamed of is letting kids access unlocked and loaded guns. But we live in a world of idiots.
Interestingly, it's about 50/50 whether people are charged for allowing that level of negligence result in the death of a child, usually their own. Most people figure no punishment can really be heavier than the loss of their own child. But half the time there are charges on top of that loss. I don't think there is such a high ratio of penalty for the millions who have abortions every year. The point is, we see little cause to shame people for things which almost everyone on the planet will invariably shame them for already on top of which they will be charged if indeed they're negligent, let alone maliciously culpable. There's no "cause" to mobilize over there. The reason people aim to shame those for having abortions is because there is no comparable legal penalty for it. Nobody is jailing or charging people for having abortions. We do jail and charge people for fucking up with guns, even if the expense was to their own family.
See, even if we never shame violent criminals for their offenses, they still have the justice system to deal with them which we trust to apportion at least some measure of shame if nothing else. If we never shame people for having abortions, there's... well nothing close to that assurance we have in legal ramifications. I do personally trust those who have abortions are burdened heavily by shame, which is why I don't see the point of those mobs shaming them. If not all of them feel shame, then a vast majority, and if not a vast majority, then a plurality, and even if it wasn't a plurality, enough surely feel shamed by it that I don't see how anyone could know who needs piling on and who doesn't without being able to read minds.
But just the idea that someone thinks of exploiting this tragedy to shame people who want to buy guns? The reason people want guns is because society is violent. Even if we magically got rid of all guns overnight, society would be no less violent. It would actually likely be more violent, if less lethal. A more desirable outcome? Yeah, probably. Less fatalities is less fatalities. But still a lot more violent. That's the case of the UK and Australia and several other 1st world nations. I realized only recently that the US is not the most violent of the 1st world nations. All this time I had assumed it was. Go figure.

Senior Member

2891 Posts
12/12
Posted - Feb 25 2018 : 12:17PM
Pieps, you really think he couldn't get a gun? There's over 300 million guns out there. It could be made a little more difficult, which like I said, have at it. More thorough screening is what I'd suggest from the beginning. But I'm not so optimistic that it would have prevented this.
By nook or by crook, lunatics still somehow end up getting guns.
So I don't care if it was a security guard, a police officer, a teacher, the principal, or the fuckin janitor. I just wish someone there had a gun and wasn't afraid to shoot that fucker in the head before he shot at one more soul.
If that's what it comes to, I don't see why there isn't at least two officers on the premises of a school in session at all times. I seem to remember there was always at least one at my high school. Or it just seemed that way. Sometimes seeming is all it takes. Most deterrence comes from mere presence. A message has to be sent. Right now that message is "gun free" = free reign for the deranged. That's gotta change.
Until it does, all this talk won't make a 1% difference.

Senior Member

"In Defense of Rape and Incest" by Steve King
6995 Posts
11/13
Posted - Feb 25 2018 : 2:24PM
Nobody jails people for abortions because they are legal.
People are jailed for 'fucking up with guns' (unless they are Dick Cheney) because it's not legal to shoot people.
We don't jail people for owning guns because it's legal.
 
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BOYCOTT JAMES DEEN - BOYCOTT COMPANIES THAT BOOK HIM OR SELL HIS WORK. YES, IT'S THAT BLACK & WHITE.
6939 Posts
8/15
Posted - Feb 25 2018 : 5:08PM
^
Cheney shoots his "friend" in the face then gets him to say it was his own fault that Cheney shot him in the face. That's mind control shit right there.
 
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BOYCOTT JAMES DEEN - BOYCOTT COMPANIES THAT BOOK HIM OR SELL HIS WORK. YES, IT'S THAT BLACK & WHITE.
6939 Posts
8/15
Posted - Feb 25 2018 : 5:09PM
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BOYCOTT JAMES DEEN - BOYCOTT COMPANIES THAT BOOK HIM OR SELL HIS WORK. YES, IT'S THAT BLACK & WHITE.
6939 Posts
8/15
Posted - Feb 25 2018 : 5:25PM
Florida shooting survivor tells NRA supporters trying to discredit witnesses:
Best. Comeback. Ever.
 
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BOYCOTT JAMES DEEN - BOYCOTT COMPANIES THAT BOOK HIM OR SELL HIS WORK. YES, IT'S THAT BLACK & WHITE.
6939 Posts
8/15
Posted - Feb 25 2018 : 5:43PM
SCOTUS: Washington D.C. Vs Heller Response section 2 - June 26, 2006:
Edited by - FlacFan on 2/25/2018 5:44:47 PM

Senior Member

"In Defense of Rape and Incest" by Steve King
6995 Posts
11/13
Posted - Feb 25 2018 : 6:08PM
Companies cutting ties with the NRA (most are ending discounts for NRA members):
The First National Bank of Omaha said it will stop issuing an NRA-branded Visa card.
Enterprise Rent-A-Car, Alamo Rent a Car and National Car Rental
Symantec (SYMC), which makes the Norton anti-virus software and owns the identity theft protection company LifeLock
Hertz
MetLife
SimpliSafe
Avis and Budget Rent a Car
Allied and North American van lines
TrueCar
Delta Air Lines
United Airlines
Wyndham Hotel Group
Paramount RX prescription discount program
Starkey hearing aids
Republic Bank
Teladoc telemedicine company
Best Western hotels
.................................................................and the list keeps growing
 
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BOYCOTT JAMES DEEN - BOYCOTT COMPANIES THAT BOOK HIM OR SELL HIS WORK. YES, IT'S THAT BLACK & WHITE.
6939 Posts
8/15
Posted - Feb 25 2018 : 6:21PM
^
[link inactive:404 - Page not found]NRA called them "cowards"

Senior Member

"In Defense of Rape and Incest" by Steve King
6995 Posts
11/13
Posted - Feb 25 2018 : 7:11PM
This really is off topic, but
If this truly is an interest of yours, there is lots of information out there.
By the way, anyone who is spewing venom about abortion should be spewing the same venom at in vitro fertilization, and at IUDs. One results in fertilized eggs being thrown away, and the other stops the implantation of a fertilized egg.
If the right really cared about it. But they don't.

Senior Member

Gone for a walk.
1636 Posts
5/08
Posted - Feb 26 2018 : 2:06PM

The only thing more pathetic than him saying this is that he has millions of brain-dead fans who actually believe that Cadet Bonespurs is courageous enough to do this.

Senior Member

"In Defense of Rape and Incest" by Steve King
6995 Posts
11/13
Posted - Feb 26 2018 : 2:28PM
I'm picturing Trump using a child as a human shield.

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Gone for a walk.
1636 Posts
5/08
Posted - Feb 26 2018 : 2:31PM
^
 
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BOYCOTT JAMES DEEN - BOYCOTT COMPANIES THAT BOOK HIM OR SELL HIS WORK. YES, IT'S THAT BLACK & WHITE.
6939 Posts
8/15
Posted - Feb 26 2018 : 2:33PM
^^
You mean as Stephen King foretold?
Trump Stillson.jpg
Edited by - FlacFan on 2/26/2018 3:01:18 PM
 
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Woman of the Decade
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Posted - Feb 26 2018 : 2:38PM
^
Damn I had totally forgotten about that movie!! I seriously need to watch it again.
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Woman of the Decade
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Posted - Feb 26 2018 : 4:53PM
BTW, remember the Access Hollywood tape? Trump couldn't figure out how to open the door on a bus.
But he'd rush into to a school to confront a mass shooter, no problem.
 
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Woman of the Decade
13923 Posts
1/08
Posted - Feb 26 2018 : 4:56PM

Senior Member

"In Defense of Rape and Incest" by Steve King
6995 Posts
11/13
Posted - Feb 26 2018 : 7:26PM

Go, Emma!
 
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BOYCOTT JAMES DEEN - BOYCOTT COMPANIES THAT BOOK HIM OR SELL HIS WORK. YES, IT'S THAT BLACK & WHITE.
6939 Posts
8/15
Posted - Feb 27 2018 : 12:48AM
[link inactive:404 - Page not found]Georgia GOP leader threatens Delta over cutting its NRA ties

Senior Member

Real news. Fake president.
13914 Posts
3/03
Posted - Feb 27 2018 : 12:51AM
You know what's pathetic?

Senior Member

"In Defense of Rape and Incest" by Steve King
6995 Posts
11/13
Posted - Feb 27 2018 : 1:59AM
[ invalid url ]
Some of these were also on the daily show. Even if you don't feel like reading it all, check out the 3 second video of Trump reacting when a bald eagle leans toward him and flaps its wings.

Senior Member

1048 Posts
1/14
Posted - Feb 27 2018 : 8:18AM
I think it is the solution. Next time there's a mass shooting, take Trump there and push him inside.
 
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Literotica.com - grover10
28999 Posts
11/04
Posted - Feb 27 2018 : 10:32AM
^ [raises hand] Oh oh! Can I be the one to push him inside? Please?
 
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BOYCOTT JAMES DEEN - BOYCOTT COMPANIES THAT BOOK HIM OR SELL HIS WORK. YES, IT'S THAT BLACK & WHITE.
6939 Posts
8/15
Posted - Feb 27 2018 : 12:17PM
Tweet.
Set.
Match.

Senior Member

"In Defense of Rape and Incest" by Steve King
6995 Posts
11/13
Posted - Feb 27 2018 : 5:54PM
I hope 500 walk out. Hanover NH is pretty nice.
Also -- Yale, MIT, Boston University, Tulane, Brown, Northeastern, and many more. I'm guessing pretty much all of 'em.
Brandeis -- "Speak up, speak out."
A_Fan
Deactivated User

1212 Posts
9/16
Posted - Feb 27 2018 : 9:24PM
This is a point I discuss with people often. The NRA/GOP types are opposed to government oversight and threats to their liberty when it comes to guns, but are perfectly happy to submit to mounds of paperwork, checks, double checks, restrictions, renewals, restrictions based on eyesight and physical health, etc for something like driving. If we ran gun control like drivers licensing we wouldn't be in a lot of the mess we are in.

Senior Member

Real news. Fake president.
13914 Posts
3/03
Posted - Feb 27 2018 : 9:59PM
^ Driving is a "privilege," not a constitutionally protected right. The 2nd Amendment would have to be repealed or rewritten.

Senior Member

"In Defense of Rape and Incest" by Steve King
6995 Posts
11/13
Posted - Feb 27 2018 : 10:30PM
The Supreme Court has ruled that the right gun ownership is not unrestricted.
So it doesn't need to be repealed.

 
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BOYCOTT JAMES DEEN - BOYCOTT COMPANIES THAT BOOK HIM OR SELL HIS WORK. YES, IT'S THAT BLACK & WHITE.
6939 Posts
8/15
Posted - Feb 27 2018 : 10:36PM
^^
Harri:
District of Columbia v. Heller, Decided June 26, 2008, Response section 2:
Like most rights, the Second Amendment right is not unlimited. It is not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose: For example, concealed weapons prohibitions have been upheld under the Amendment or state analogues. The Court’s opinion should not be taken to cast doubt on longstanding prohibitions on the possession of firearms by felons and the mentally ill, or laws forbidding the carrying of firearms in sensitive places such as schools and government buildings, or laws imposing conditions and qualifications on the commercial sale of arms. Miller’s holding that the sorts of weapons protected are those “in common use at the time” finds support in the historical tradition of prohibiting the carrying of dangerous and unusual weapons.[/quote]
The NRA doesn't talk about that ruling, ever.
It in no way infringes on the right to own weapons if a person is required to have a licence to own them, it merely means there is a record of who owns what. I would, at the same time, ban resale of seized fire arms, mandating their destruction instead..
Edit:
Pieps beat me there by 6 minutes [swear]
Edited by - FlacFan on 2/27/2018 10:47:37 PM

Senior Member

Real news. Fake president.
13914 Posts
3/03
Posted - Feb 28 2018 : 12:29AM
I didn't say it was unrestricted right. But it is a right. Driving is not. The idea that we can impose the same kind of comprehensive control over constitutionally protected conduct that we can over conduct which is considered a mere privilege is just wrong.

Senior Member

"In Defense of Rape and Incest" by Steve King
6995 Posts
11/13
Posted - Feb 28 2018 : 2:19AM
But the types of regulations that have been suggested -- that protestors are asking for -- don't require any changes in the Second Amendment.
 
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BOYCOTT JAMES DEEN - BOYCOTT COMPANIES THAT BOOK HIM OR SELL HIS WORK. YES, IT'S THAT BLACK & WHITE.
6939 Posts
8/15
Posted - Feb 28 2018 : 2:31AM
^
Bingo. Only fear mongering is preventing that.

Senior Member

2970 Posts
2/15
Posted - Feb 28 2018 : 2:42AM
Interesting article. Main reason: it's the energy of youth
 
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BOYCOTT JAMES DEEN - BOYCOTT COMPANIES THAT BOOK HIM OR SELL HIS WORK. YES, IT'S THAT BLACK & WHITE.
6939 Posts
8/15
Posted - Feb 28 2018 : 4:26AM
^
Exactly.
fuck calm.jpg

Senior Member

1048 Posts
1/14
Posted - Feb 28 2018 : 6:08AM
Depends what you mean by "comprehensive". Driving may not be protected under the Constitution (mind you there weren't too many cars on the road in 1787) but try and restrict the use of cars and see what happens!
 
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Woman of the Decade
13923 Posts
1/08
Posted - Feb 28 2018 : 8:28AM
No doubt about it, this is a big time sea change.
 
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Woman of the Decade
13923 Posts
1/08
Posted - Feb 28 2018 : 8:37AM
^^
No one would ever try to blanket restrict auto use, because it would make no sense. Yes, people get into accidents, yes people die from cars. But cars are not made for the express use of killing. Guns are. So we restrict certain people's use of them: (alcoholics, people with poor eyesight, etc.)

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1048 Posts
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Posted - Feb 28 2018 : 9:48AM
^ Yeah, I wasn't really serious.
 
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BOYCOTT JAMES DEEN - BOYCOTT COMPANIES THAT BOOK HIM OR SELL HIS WORK. YES, IT'S THAT BLACK & WHITE.
6939 Posts
8/15
Posted - Feb 28 2018 : 9:50AM
^^
It's always in the details but yes, the Dune sized worm has turned in the gun debate.
 
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Literotica.com - grover10
28999 Posts
11/04
Posted - Feb 28 2018 : 9:56AM
 
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Woman of the Decade
13923 Posts
1/08
Posted - Feb 28 2018 : 10:27AM
This is quite possibly the Republican-est headline we'll see this year:
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