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Senior Member

Real news. Fake president.
13914 Posts
3/03
Posted - Jun 29 2009 : 10:32PM
-----------------------------SPOILERS---------------------------------------
Fucking the pharmacist every day? Lunches at some ritzy restaurant with an oddball posh Brit doctor? Flushing body parts belonging to patients you don't like down the toilet?
Remind me never to be hospitalized again.

Senior Member

5491 Posts
6/04
Posted - Jun 29 2009 : 10:36PM
If only more people knew how to do the same.

Senior Member

And on that fateful day, the hatred consumed me...
4693 Posts
3/09
Posted - Jun 29 2009 : 10:38PM
Obviously over the course of this thread, it's gone back to the kiddy-diddling scandal surrounding Michael; with all the talk of if he actually molested them or if he just got away with it because he was a mega-rich superstar...
I think that any attempt to correctly ascertain this is null and void, for the sheer fact of who we're dealing with: Truly, does anyone really know any other human like Michael Jackson...? To me, he was unique to the point of almost being alien to this planet.
He had lied to the public several times (including ludicrous, straight-faced statements that he only had either one or two plastic surgery procedures ever), but undoubtedly, his mindset was set in some fantastical, yearning, romantasised state of arrested development - He had a private theme-park, he had a chimpanzee for a best friend, he wore elaborate fat-guy suits to walk about Disneyland, he went around stores buying expensive artifacts like penny sweets, he climbed a tree for private contemplation time... He wasn't like anyone else I could think of.
Therefore, to me I find it possible to believe that his relationship with the kids that he had 'round his place was purely platonic and non-sexual. He could be sleeping in the same bed with them, and in his mind, he'd be an equal - a peer aged around 10. From this highly unusual setup, it'd SO easy to make a sexual abuse claim, just because of the compromising position he would put himself in having these "slumber parties".
The OJ case and MJ case are not alike at all... One's a DEFINITE murder (with a body, glove, blood etc.), the other's an alleged series of sexual assaults that would be hard to prove either way. The closest that came was a strip search made on Jackson to match the intimate physical description made by his accuser... Results were open to interpretation.
Once the shit hit, the stigma of the allegations alone would be impossible to totally eradicate. If he was innocent of intimately touching the kids, he would still live under the shadow of suspicion always in the eyes of millions - that would be a very hard thing to deal with...
I'm not saying he's innocent of this, I'm not saying he's guilty of this... I don't know. The point of this post was just to point out that any attempts to rationalise the personal motivations and thoughts of Michael Jackson by people on here or worldwide is pretty much pointless because he wasn't like anyone else you could use to take an example from. He was though, a great pop star, and cultural icon, and now he's dead... All the chatter doesn't change anything.
[Edit: spelling]

Edited by - Dubious_Leftovers on 6/29/2009 10:39:38 PM


Senior Member

Real news. Fake president.
13914 Posts
3/03
Posted - Jun 29 2009 : 10:39PM
We're talking about someone so massively egotistical that he christened himself "The King of Pop," and made all of his participation with the media contingent on them using this title in referring to him. It's not such a stretch to believe that such an individual would consider himself entitled to do whatever he wanted, and to be above criticism or prosecution.
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Perpetual Marxist

13855 Posts
4/03
Posted - Jun 30 2009 : 1:08AM
I like that Joe Jackson "I'm the Man" song. I've got a ska version of it on a Buck-O-Nine cd from like 1996/7.

Senior Member

Enjoy!
28284 Posts
3/06
Posted - Jun 30 2009 : 1:35AM
Like another poster said, it's not much of a stretch to believe anything about MJ because he was just so damn weird. Someone could tell me he had sex with that monkey of his while dressed like Cinderella and I wouldn't find it entirely unbelievable. Anything weird isn't going to sound that far fetched if you're talking about Michael Jackson.
the unknown pervert
Deactivated User

I'd like to stay but I've got a plane to catch.
17482 Posts
5/06
Posted - Jun 30 2009 : 2:32AM
I agree with your main point but in the Gotti case it wasn't his expensive lawyer that got him off. It was his lackeys in D.A.'s offices that were able to get a hold of the jurors lists so he could buy off members of the jury that got him acquitted.

Senior Member

5491 Posts
6/04
Posted - Jun 30 2009 : 8:06AM
MJ didn't christen himself the "King of Pop," neither is it proven that he ever forced anyone to call him that. As many times as I ever heard MJ speak, I never once heard him refer to himself by that title, as deserved as it is. To the contrary, I read that it was Liz Taylor who first publicly referred to him as the "King of Pop" upon presenting him with an award. Apparently, the title has stuck ever since. As for "believing" what he did or didn't do, what you "believe" doesn't matter. You can believe that the sky is pink if you want to. That's up to you. The fact of the matter remains that there's no proof. So you're just believing stuff that you don't know to be true.
Anyway, since there appear to be some people who refuse to allow this man a modicum of respect and dignity even in death by focusing on negative and unproven allegations upon which people can only speculate, I prefer to focus on the positive things he did in life, that we know are true:
-Founded the Heal the World Foundation, which promoted world relief of poverty and hunger, abuse prevention, as well as several other humanitarian efforts.
-Donated all the profits from his "Dangerous World Tour" to his Heal the World Foundation.
-One of the first celebrities to help bring public and political attention to supporting HIV/AIDS prevention, research, treatment, and charities in the 1980's and 1990's.
-Helped to raise millions of dollars for refugees of Kosovo and other war-torn countries.
-Donated millions of dollars to charities such as UNESCO, the Red Cross, UNCF, etc.
-Donated millions of dollars to scholarships, schools, hospitals, orphanages, youth organizations, disease research centers, etc.
-Listed atleast twice in the Guinness Book of World Records: (1) Credited as "Most Successful Entertainer of All Time;" and (2) Acknowledged for supporting more charities than any other celebrity or public personality.
-Donated his entire settlement against Pepsi to a burn treatment center, later known as the Michael Jackson Burn Center.
-Co-wrote We Are the World, which resulted in raising millions of dollars in funds for African countries affected by drought and famine.
-Organized successful benefit concert in tribute to victims of 9/11.
-Received international humanitarian award from African diplomats for charitable work and support throughout the African continent.
-Received two presidential awards: (1) Award from President Ronald Reagan on behalf of his generous charitable involvement; and (2) Artist of the Decade Award from President G.H.W. Bush.
-One of very few successful popular artists who actually wrote most of his own songs.
As far as I'm concerned, these actions far outweigh all the petty slanders and innuendos. To paraphrase what a wise man once said, We shall know the character of a man by his works. Therefore, I prefer to judge a man by his good works rather than just what some people say he did.

Senior Member

If you don't break the rules, you'll never have any fun!
1449 Posts
10/06
Posted - Jun 30 2009 : 9:13AM
I have only seen one episode of "Nurse Jackie". I do not get Showtime, but the first episode was put up on YouTube, so I watched it there. Now while I can tell you that I know for certain that I am not scoring drugs from and fucking the hospital pharmacist, the grittiness of the program is much more real than a show like ER. The "Saints In Surgical Garb" crap is just that. Crap. However, the scene where Nurse Jackie blows her stack at some shiny-new ER doc because he wouldn't do a CT Scan on a patient when she told him to hits close to home. The patient died, because the doc figured he knew everything. A good experienced ER/Trauma/ICU nurse is far more likely to understand what's going on with a patient, than a newly-minted physician. As far as not wanting to be hospitalized, let me tell you this. You are going to be 100% better off if you have a nurse like Nurse Jackie to take care of you, because she's REALLY going to care what happens to you, and will fight for you, and will argue with the doctors for you. That lady is going to bust her tail to make sure you get what you need. Trust me on this. Now as far as flushing body parts down the toilet, let me add this. In my own career, I have been transitioning more into handling rape cases. In fact, I have posted on here in the past following a couple of particularly ugly cases, needing to vent off the stress of those events. I like doing the rape-case work, because I feel like I am really doing something that helps. When you deal with some of the crap that comes with these rape victims, there certainly is an amount of temptation to find a way to dispense some sort of justice, just as Nurse Jackie did by flushing the ear down the toilet. No, I don't know of anyone who has dumped a severed ear (or any other appendage) into the pot, but I think that scene explained some of the frustration that we see in our everyday work. Most people who arrive at an ER arrive on their own, with what are for the most part minor injuries. They may not be minor to you. To you, they are very serious, and often you are scared. But just as you see in Nurse Jackie, there are 100 other things happening behind the doors of the ER that you don't see, and those are the gun shots, and the rapes, and the strokes that are taking far more of our time than you would like. But a show like ER or St. Elsewhere doesn't paint you that picture. Somehow all these overly-pretty supermen & superwomen do it all, have perfect knowledge on any given situation every single time and never, ever break a sweat. Sorry, it doesn't work that way. We sweat, we don't always know the answers, and we're not all overly pretty. (Except of course for me because I'm adorable!! LOL) And despite some of the over the top examples in the show, Nurse Jackie is far closer to reality than any of the other medical/ER shows I have seen. Now don't be afraid to come see me!

Member

Blithering Birthers
673 Posts
12/05
Posted - Jun 30 2009 : 10:09AM
^and this has what to do with this thread?

Senior Member

blackcockchurch.com
7515 Posts
1/08
Posted - Jun 30 2009 : 10:59AM
Threads tend to take a life of their own. She made a reference to it earlier and I really wanted to hear her explanation. Thank you Mindee.
Clam Digger
Deactivated User

Many a man fails as an original thinker simply because his memory is too good.
9086 Posts
1/05
Posted - Jun 30 2009 : 11:04AM

TMZ.com (30 June 2009)
Edited by - Clam Digger on 6/30/2009 11:05:35 AM

Member

Blithering Birthers
673 Posts
12/05
Posted - Jun 30 2009 : 11:58AM
That kinda makes sense, given the fact the the children are almost white. You would expect his biological children to have some Jackson features. Given the history of his plastic surgeries, he didn't want to look like himself, and probably the same for the children.

Senior Member

San Diego, CA
7122 Posts
11/03
Posted - Jun 30 2009 : 12:10PM
FERNANDEZ -
Most, (not all, but most), of the foolishness and controversy surrounding Jackson has occurred in the last 20 years or so, AFTER he'd already sold a gazillion records, and AFTER he was already the biggest star in the world. And it coincided with the explosion in technology and 24-7 coverage of the stars, that feeds the public fascination with anything to do with celebrity. In this cultural environment I think Presley would have gotten the same societal response as Jackson.
As it was, when Presley had already hit it big and was the biggest star in music, he could have strangled a puppy on live t.v. and it wouldn't have hurt things. Hell, Presley final years WERE a descent into drugs, silliness, and excess, yet people ain't runnin' away from him. They're still lining up in droves to genuflect outside of Graceland.
And Howard Hughes' legend has only been enhanced by his final years of weirdness and bizarre behavior. He was a drug-addled nutjob and people are still enthralled with him.
Nah, people love this stuff.
BSD
Edited by - BSD on 6/30/2009 12:15:37 PM
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Senior Member

5645 Posts
6/08
Posted - Jun 30 2009 : 3:03PM
Well, there have been untrue rumors out already that people assumed were correct, like the fake autopsy report. While it certainly wouldn't surprise me if this was true, I don't buy it at this point in time.

Senior Member

Real news. Fake president.
13914 Posts
3/03
Posted - Jun 30 2009 : 3:27PM
Spend ten seconds on Google. Everybody from to to describe him as the "self-styled King of Pop."

Senior Member

5491 Posts
6/04
Posted - Jun 30 2009 : 4:13PM
^"Self-styled" does not mean the same as "self-named." By "self-styled," I take it to mean that he created his own unique style, which contributed to his status as the King of Pop. If they meant self-named, I think that's what they would have said.
In any case, regardless of who came up with the title, no one can deny that it is well-deserved.
Edited by - realtip on 6/30/2009 9:18:56 PM

Senior Member

blackcockchurch.com
7515 Posts
1/08
Posted - Jun 30 2009 : 7:14PM
Better yet, who is the King of Pop if not Micheal Jackson? Of course he accepted title because frankly he earned it. Hell hasn't put out a hit in years and still almost takes down the internet with him. Jackson probably should be named king of all entertainers. Maybe we should be debating if Elvis is the king of Rock N' Roll as well.

Senior Member

Real news. Fake president.
13914 Posts
3/03
Posted - Jun 30 2009 : 11:14PM
Consult a dictionary.

Member

Blithering Birthers
673 Posts
12/05
Posted - Jul 1 2009 : 1:29AM
Speaking of pedophile musicians.... Does anyone recall how old Priscilla Presley was when Elvis was courting her? She was 14 and he was 24.
I never thought MJ was guilty of being a pedophile. Just a permanent juvenile. That doesn't mean he was into little boys, I don't have any proof and find it hard to accept accusations from someone that would take a settlement rather than put a pedophile in jail.
As for Elvis, I wasn't around when he was banging a 14 year old, but it seems like selective memory to give him a pass for this transgression.

Senior Member

blackcockchurch.com
7515 Posts
1/08
Posted - Jul 1 2009 : 1:44AM
I looked it up. It more or less means self-named or self-proclaimed.

Member

456 Posts
8/08
Posted - Jul 1 2009 : 6:40AM
At least Elvis was into "girls".

Senior Member

5491 Posts
6/04
Posted - Jul 1 2009 : 7:11AM
^So if it were girls instead of boys who had made the same accusations against MJ, then you'd think it was OK?

Senior Member

If you don't break the rules, you'll never have any fun!
1449 Posts
10/06
Posted - Jul 1 2009 : 10:41AM
^^
Most definately not. While the question about Elvis dating Priscilla has some merit, at least Elivs was openly dating her, her parents knew about it, and if I'm not mistaken (since this is a bit before my time) wasn't he in the Army at that time as well? I also think that at that point in time in many states a 14 year old girl could legally marry with her parent's permission.
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Clam Digger
Deactivated User

Many a man fails as an original thinker simply because his memory is too good.
9086 Posts
1/05
Posted - Jul 1 2009 : 10:51AM
^My memory is a little hazy but Elvis met her while in the army, stationed in Germany. I believe her father was an officer there.

Senior Member

San Diego, CA
7122 Posts
11/03
Posted - Jul 1 2009 : 12:24PM
Friends -
Interesting view I heard offered from a family law attorney, through a friend of a friend of a friend. (Don't think Kevin Bacon is involved.) I guess the guy does these kinds of cases, and is supposedly familiar with Jackson's criminal case.
"It is difficult to separate fact from fiction, and in MJ's case I believe so much fiction passes as fact. My point is not just to regurgitate this thing, but to point out maybe he's not the child molestor and preyer of children that a lot of people take for granted.

This is my attempt to clarify some of the rumors and fiction that passed for fact, and to hopefully inform those whose view is simply good riddance to a child molestor that used money to avoid prosecution.

Regarding child molestation, the BEST evidence that he ever molested a child was the fact that he paid off the first complaining family millions to drop it. As weird as he was, and at the time as rich as he was and with all he had to lose by fighting and further publicizing that case, if he had not extinguished it with the payoff that was a drop in his bucket at the time, the long term implications for his life and caeer could have been worse. At least in his defense's view. It is conceivable that it was just a successful matter of extortion.
As to the case that was brought in criminal court, it was a piece of s--- case brought by a vengeful, out of control prosecutor and smelled of extortion from a manipulative piece of s--- mother. That was no OJ case - it was a righteous acquittal.
I'm not saying he was not a molestor, only that it is far from proven and if there was a crazy enough person in the world who could have led that kind of life doing innocent sleepovers with children it was Michael Jackson. You have to disregard all natural progressions of logic when it comes to analyzing how this character went about his life.

The Santa Maria case (second case) seemed pretty impregnable based on the pre-trial publicity, and then it just melted away as the trial progressed. It was an embarrassment to the cops and prosecutors, and mostly to the accusers. Not too many blowouts for the defense in criminal cases but this was one.
There is plenty of smoke around him on this subject and he may well have done some bad things, but nothing has been proven and there are enough quirks in his mental and emotional makeup that makes it impossible to reach logical conclusions that we can when the same facts are applied to "normal" individuals."
BSD

Senior Member

4047 Posts
2/07
Posted - Jul 1 2009 : 9:05PM
If I remember correctly, Michael or someone involved with him came up with the term "King Of Pop" and when Michael appeared on certain shows like award shows on MTV awards shows, part of the agreement was that they had to refer to him as "The King Of Pop". There was also at least one time that Michael wouldn't appear at one of the MTV awards shows unless they gave him some sort of special lifetime award or something of the sort.
It's fairly well known that Michael and his people would send pictures and stories to the NATIONAL ENQUIERER for them to print to keep him in the news and make him bizzare. Throughout his career Michael has done many things to get attention and make himself seem bigger than life. He had the talent to back it up but a very big part of his success was the self promotion and marketing of himself. He made certain that whatever he did turned into an event.
Michael was talented in several areas that all contributed to his success.

Senior Member

Choooooooch!
10537 Posts
7/02
Posted - Jul 2 2009 : 12:48AM
I'm sorry, people but I'm calling enough. I am Michael-Jackson-ed out. Each of the major networks has had 3 or 4 hour-long specials; MSNBC has suspended much of its regular nightly programming; add in CNN with Anderson Cooper and Larry King, various and sundry other networks going berserk. This is approaching the quantity of coverage of 9/11. Please stop. I've taken to watching the Screaming Cramer just for some relief in the evenings.

Senior Member

Enjoy!
28284 Posts
3/06
Posted - Jul 2 2009 : 1:12AM
You don't have to read this thread.

Senior Member

blackcockchurch.com
7515 Posts
1/08
Posted - Jul 2 2009 : 7:02AM

Senior Member

If you don't break the rules, you'll never have any fun!
1449 Posts
10/06
Posted - Jul 2 2009 : 11:28AM
It is interesting what we value as a society. Right now there are any number of important things that need to be debated and solved in this country and the world. For what amounts to an entire week virtually all of these things have been pushed off to the sidelines while the nation & it's various media debate serious things like whether or not Michael left a will or if there is a will is Joe Jackson being left out of it, and what zoot suit will Michael be buried in, or whether or not Michael will forego a funeral and just rise from the dead. All of these things being breathlessly covered with the same importance as if Iran had unleashed a nuclear bomb on Isreal. And the sad part is, had Michael Jackson not died last week, we would be going through the same spasms over Farrah Fawcett. I'm with Billy. Enough. Let's all go watch "Nurse Jackie". :-)

Dianic

Wicked Pictures,Vouyer Media, Axel Braun Productions, Marc Dorcel, JoyBear Pictures, abbywinters.com
12401 Posts
7/05
Posted - Jul 2 2009 : 11:44AM

Senior Member

Good Night and Good Hockey
2499 Posts
7/05
Posted - Jul 2 2009 : 2:12PM
I heard they are charging $25 to get into the funeral and will sell his concert tees from the July shows outside...I really hope that isn't true...Pay to be at his funeral..you have to be kidding me.

Senior Member

blackcockchurch.com
7515 Posts
1/08
Posted - Jul 2 2009 : 3:16PM
^I don't doubt it if Joe Jackson is involved.

Member

31 Posts
7/09
Posted - Jul 2 2009 : 6:09PM
Michael Jackson is a great performer i just loss a little bit of respect after the sex allegation even though not proven.

Senior Member

blackcockchurch.com
7515 Posts
1/08
Posted - Jul 2 2009 : 7:04PM
I can't believe how good he was dancing in the rehearsals 48hrs before his death. Moving like that as a 50year old is amazing.
the unknown pervert
Deactivated User

I'd like to stay but I've got a plane to catch.
17482 Posts
5/06
Posted - Jul 2 2009 : 7:27PM
Sounds more like Beat It and ABC.

Senior Member

Enjoy!
28284 Posts
3/06
Posted - Jul 2 2009 : 7:37PM
So if you are accused of something and it's never proved and you are acquitted, you should be hounded for the rest of your life and even after your death? What if prison wardens took it upon themselves to let convicted prisoners go because they didn't agree with the jury verdict?
Why do we have trials at all if we're not going to respect the verdict?

Senior Member

San Diego, CA
7122 Posts
11/03
Posted - Jul 2 2009 : 9:49PM
Friends -
Definitely "Beat It/Billie Jean".
Looked like ol' boy had a little flava in him. Knew how to get his groove on. Play on playa.
BSD

Dianic

Wicked Pictures,Vouyer Media, Axel Braun Productions, Marc Dorcel, JoyBear Pictures, abbywinters.com
12401 Posts
7/05
Posted - Jul 2 2009 : 10:23PM
^ I stand corrected; I'm glad I stumbled upon the clip, as this is the closest I may ever come to hearing the MJ catalogue as interpreted by Keith Emerson.
 
All-Star Member

Marv Montag ()
5437 Posts
2/09
Posted - Jul 3 2009 : 1:03AM
In the car on a long ride today, we listened to some of his songs (major hits--"Billie Jean", "Beat It", "Thriller", "Man in the Mirror") again in their entirety.
The guy was pretty amazing.

Senior Member

A rose is what you are to me
10480 Posts
6/03
Posted - Jul 3 2009 : 1:16AM
That organist did a great job. What better way to pay tribute to Michael than play some of his songs? Like I said before, that's what he should be remembered for.

Senior Member

"Don't let your lava love turn to stone."
6784 Posts
5/06
Posted - Jul 3 2009 : 6:28AM
Billie Jean is no Caribbean Queen.

Senior Member

If you don't break the rules, you'll never have any fun!
1449 Posts
10/06
Posted - Jul 3 2009 : 9:11AM
I have been wondering how long it will take for the "He's not really dead" stories to start circulating. I expect that the National Enquirer will start running stories that he's really working at a Burger King in Milwaukee with Elvis any day now.

Senior Member

Good Night and Good Hockey
2499 Posts
7/05
Posted - Jul 3 2009 : 10:00AM
^ I was thinking the same thing last week...we'll have Tupac and MJ in concert with a cameo by Biggie Big and maybe even Elvis...

Senior Member

If you don't break the rules, you'll never have any fun!
1449 Posts
10/06
Posted - Jul 3 2009 : 10:15AM
All financed and promoted by Howard Hughes!

Senior Member

Luton Piss On Watford... Tis True
3952 Posts
4/08
Posted - Jul 3 2009 : 1:37PM
Didn't you know that in some peoples eyes even the allegation proves, in their mind, that they are guilty, let alone that they were acquitted.
 
All-Star Member

Marv Montag ()
5437 Posts
2/09
Posted - Jul 3 2009 : 1:47PM
In fact, we saw him out and about just yesterday.
He's working at an Exxon station on the Jersey Turnpike.
Nice guy--a little shy, though.


Senior Member

5491 Posts
6/04
Posted - Jul 3 2009 : 2:43PM
That must be just a rumor. I heard it announced on one of the morning shows today that the service will be at the Staples Center, and the family is giving away 11,000 tickets (for free). If I lived in L.A., I would try to go. But since the media is calling it a "memorial" service rather than a funeral, I'm just wondering whether or not his body will be on display at the service.
I did hear some ABC played in there too. It was a nice tribute. At our church last Sunday, there was no direct mention whatsoever about MJ's death during the service. Who would have thought that the Episcopalians would ever be cooler than the Baptists?

Senior Member

San Diego, CA
7122 Posts
11/03
Posted - Jul 3 2009 : 3:00PM
REALTIP -
You are correct.
I meant to write "Beat It/ABC". Don't know why I wrote "Billie Jean". Hands too fast for the brain I think.
BSD
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