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Woman of the Decade
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Posted - Feb 28 2014 : 10:00AM





 
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Woman of the Decade
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Posted - Feb 28 2014 : 10:05AM
And yes, I know, it's a tough job, decisions often have to be made in split seconds etc.
But that are thousands of interactions between cops and private citizens every day that DON'T end in these types of incidents. Poor training? Itchy trigger fingers? Something else?

fubar

7535 Posts
12/09
Posted - Feb 28 2014 : 10:21AM
The decay of law and order in a disintegrating empire happens on both sides of the badge.
 
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Woman of the Decade
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Posted - Mar 20 2014 : 10:36PM
A Philadelphia man was in an ambulance after suffering a seizure at a restaurant.

Senior Member

3890 Posts
2/03
Posted - Mar 20 2014 : 10:51PM
I wish I had saved the article because I can't find it now, but a couple of years ago Germany's FBI reported that they had fired fewer than 100 shots in anger in the entire country, over the entire year. And most of those were deliberate misses (warning shots).
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fubar

7535 Posts
12/09
Posted - May 8 2014 : 1:02PM
American cops have the same problem as the British military a century ago and the American military today: they don't know how to do their jobs without overwhelming force. As gangs get more money to buy guns, cops escalate with military equipment and tactics. That's a losing battle. The government can't pay for tanks on every street.
 
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Fat bottomed girls make the rockin' world go round!
3279 Posts
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Posted - May 8 2014 : 10:16PM
Rookies...out to change the world. Veteran cops know better. They don't risk their pensions with rookie mistakes. In those cities were they have a high turn over in law enforcement, either from a lack of support or low pay, they have many rookies, with little experience. You get what you pay for.
 
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Woman of the Decade
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Posted - May 8 2014 : 10:55PM
^^
None of the examples I've provided have anything to do with gangs.
I'm pretty sure the 70-year old with the cane is not a member of the Crips.
Wait, let me rephrase that...
 
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Woman of the Decade
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Posted - May 8 2014 : 11:00PM
Two drunken NYPD cops fired their guns in separate, off-duty incidents, one of which involved an officer emptying his handgun — firing 13 rounds — at a man inside a nearby car, hitting him six times, police sources said Wednesday.
Both cops were arrested. The lawman who fired a baker's dozen, Officer Brendan Cronin, who is assigned to the 46th Precinct in the Bronx, was behind the wheel in Pelham, Westchester County, late Tuesday night when he unloaded on a 47-year-old man who was a passenger in a car that was idling in front of him, Pelham Police Chief Joseph Benefico said.
Cronin was apparently so intoxicated he later claimed he "doesn’t remember what happened," a police source said.
About three hours later, outside a strip club in Somerset County, N.J., NYPD Sgt. Wanda Anthony, assigned to the 122nd Precinct in Staten Island, fired at least one round at a former boyfriend and his new squeeze, law enforcement sources said. No one was hit. Anthony, who fled in a car, was pulled over and charged with driving while intoxicated following the 3 a.m. incident by the Watchung Police Dept.
The back-to-back off-duty shootings followed an incident Thursday in which off-duty Det. Jay Poggi shot his partner through the wrist after each had downed at least 11 drinks in the Rockaways. “I personally am very disturbed about a number of incidents in recent weeks that are part of a long-term problem of inappropriate use of alcohol by members of the department,” NYPD Commissioner Bill Bratton said.



 
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Posted - May 9 2014 : 1:17AM
When you stare into the abyss the abyss stares back at you. We really can't expect any human being to see what some cops see on a regular basis and not be emotionally traumatized by it. Add high levels of stress and you've got all the makings of a mental breakdown. Unfortunately, the standard coping mechanisms for too many cops have been alcohol and drugs. Shutting down your fore brain doesn't resolve your problems, it only accomplishes a loss of self control, with predictable results.
 
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"liable to deprave and corrupt"
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Posted - May 9 2014 : 10:10AM
How much and how long do cops have to study/train in the US? Here it is between 1.5 year (lowest rank, usually they don't carry a gun) and 4 years (highest level) and they combine school and working during that time.
Jacco
 
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Posted - May 9 2014 : 6:52PM
Big cities tend to have police academies. I suppose that smaller towns do procedural training online these days. That, and they pair up newbies with veterans in order to gain practical experience.

Senior Member

3520 Posts
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Posted - May 11 2014 : 8:45PM
In Michigan most aspiring police go through a police academy during the summer of their junior year of college, going on to graduate with a degree in criminal justice (several universities in the state system have a police academy), most city and county police hire these people. The State Police run their own academy where no college education is technically required but most in practice have a bachelor's degree in criminal justice as well. All academies include the test for MCOLES certification as well as both physical conditioning and criminology education. Most start out as road patrol officer and work their way up to detective, sergeant, lieutenant, captain, chief, etc. over a 20 year career. Pensions after retirement are about 90% of average final three year salary with full health insurance.
In the States police are well protected with any type of gun, protective vest, etc. available to them as needed in most departments (the three officer village departments covering a population of 500 may not have the full implement of weapons available, larger county departments are available for when these are needed). Known violent offenders are quite often arrested by heavily armed groups of officers known as a SWAT team potentially using every non nuclear weapon in existence including military tanks and armored personnel carriers. In most states if an offender shoots a police officer dead he is executed after trial and appeal, a few states (very few) such as Michigan do not have the death penalty so the perp is locked up in a prison for life instead (usually a very short life if you get my drift).

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3890 Posts
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Posted - May 11 2014 : 10:40PM
One point to note is that police officers issued a gun do NOT receive marksman training and do not have to pass a sharpshooter test. If they can hit the broad side of a barn that's good enough. It encourages a "spray & pray" mentality. The training isn't *that* hard but there is fierce resistance to it, and officers who can shoot accurately are discouraged from it.

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Posted - May 12 2014 : 2:28AM
For one thing, that cop was appropriately distraught over his mistake. What's more, between sobs, he asked the right question. Why did the guy get out of his truck? You never get out unless you're ordered to do so.
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Posted - May 13 2014 : 4:33PM
In Michigan training for accuracy in shooting is part of the academy curriculum. Some departments have shooting ranges for officers to maintain their shooting skills once employed. Most officers aren't sharpshooters by any means but they can shoot accurately enough that they usually hit their target somewhere and not bystanders. In my area most officers are also sportsmen and deer hunters so they usually can shoot and hit their target before even starting in the police academy. The academy serves to teach them to shoot a pistol (most deer hunting in my area is by shotgun or rifle), after a few hundred rounds of familiarization and practice their rifle skills transfer to a pistol just fine.
Please note that good marksmanship does not get you out of all jams. We had an officer that was actually a militarily trained sharpshooter killed by a perp's bullet on Mackinac Island about 15 years back (he worked for my city's department before taking that job on the island so it made the local papers here).
Blue Agave
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Posted - May 13 2014 : 9:23PM
(1) Appropriately distraught?
(2) Ordered?
 
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Posted - May 31 2014 : 12:35PM


By Radley Balko
May 30 at 12:37 pm
There's more. Apparently details are a little hazy; as of this time no drugs were found, but an arrest was made.

fubar

7535 Posts
12/09
Posted - Jun 9 2014 : 6:28PM

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Posted - Jun 9 2014 : 9:10PM
 
Oblivious

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Posted - Jun 12 2014 : 9:23AM
Oh damn.
 
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Posted - Jun 25 2014 : 10:51AM

Update: As of the afternoon of 6/24/2014, Baby Bou Bou has been taken out of the medically induced coma and transferred to a new hospital to begin rehabilitation. The hole in his chest has yet to heal, and doctors are still not able to fully assess lasting brain damage.

fubar

7535 Posts
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Posted - Jun 26 2014 : 1:08PM
Here is a big step in the decay of our civilization: .
Edited by - charn on 6/26/2014 1:08:56 PM
 
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Posted - Jun 28 2014 : 11:49PM

A new video shows Dr. Ersula Ore, a professor at Arizona State University, -- yes, she's female -- body slammed by a police officer after being stopped for jaywalking near campus. But it’s Ore who is facing charges for resisting arrest, assaulting a police officer, and other crimes.

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Posted - Jun 29 2014 : 10:39PM
Oh, whoopty do, another academic who thinks that it's beneath her to have to interact with, and, god forbid, actually have to comply with anything a cop tells her to do. Beer with Obama to follow, no doubt.
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Posted - Jun 29 2014 : 11:21PM
Arizona police? I'm surprised she's still breathing.
 
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Posted - Jun 30 2014 : 1:20AM
^^
Yes, and, as we all know we have to stop this insidious crime in its tracks. (literally!)
Today she's just jaywalking...but tomorrow she'll go on a killing spree inside a Walmart.
 
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Posted - Jun 30 2014 : 1:52AM
Had the professor just let the policeman take the lead, kept calm and been polite she would probably have gotten an opportunity to offer an explanation for her jaywalking, and had she given it without rancor it would probably have gotten her off with a warning. There may be times when you need to confront authority, but I don't see that this was one of them.
PS - "The others were doing it, too" failed to influence my mother by the time I was six.
 
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Posted - Jun 30 2014 : 2:12AM
^
Sure she should have been more cooperative. But seeing as how she wasn't, (and also seeing as how, every once in a while, you're going to have some difficult people -- especially those murderous jaywalkers) shouldn't there be police training on how to handle such situations without WWE finishing moves?

Edited by - Smiler Grogan on 6/30/2014 2:12:59 AM


Deactivated Member

3590 Posts
12/04
Posted - Jun 30 2014 : 4:16PM
What's wrong with "Cops"?
i dunno...the camera work is shaky at times but I love the teme song..."Whatcha gonna do when they come for you, bad boyz..."
 
Golden Age Classic

13508 Posts
5/01
Posted - Jun 30 2014 : 6:26PM
Jaywalking being targeted is not that uncommon on the campus where I go, I have been forced by cops several times when jaywalking to return to the side I started on and wait for a crosswalk light or face arrest.

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Real news. Fake president.
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Posted - Jun 30 2014 : 8:52PM
Oh, you mean the training in the mystical kung fu ninja hypnosis bullshit by which, in your imaginary world, a police officer can subdue a combative and actively resisting suspect without even having having to touch her or disturb a hair on her head (and which does not, thankfully, leave her feeling "disrespected")? Yeah, they should totally start doing that in Arizona.

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7829 Posts
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Posted - Jun 30 2014 : 9:15PM
I get that there is racism alive and well in this country (and others). I get that. I really do.
I read the comments section and there are a lot of people telling me to "put myself in her place" - but the thing is, I can't. I JUST CAN'T. You know why I can't? Because no matter what the fuck I'm doing if a cop asks me to quit and show ID I fucking quit and show ID. I could be praying over my dead granny's grave and I'd whip out my ID and put my hands in the air. That's what I was taught! I wouldn't be sass-mouthing no matter what kind of asshat I thought the cop was or how fucktarded I thought his/her/its actions were.
Yes, I've been arrested, I know what I would do! I know who has the power, right or wrong, in that situation and I sure as hell know that acting like I have rights ain't gonna make the situation better for me. Rights is what you have AFTER you call your lawyer. Before then, it's "Yes sir, I understand sir, how can I better assist you sir?"
Period.
 
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Posted - Jun 30 2014 : 10:03PM
Unfortunately, that depends. If you are a known quantity - a family member or a relative of a colleague then you probably will get individual treatment. Well, unless you're the bad seed. If you're sitting on the ground offering little prospect of a confrontation then you probably should get individual treatment.
However, if you're bad-mouthing a police officer then you've already adopted an adversarial stance, as opposed to a neutral but non-compliant stance, which means that you're nudging the situation out of control. This, as I already noted, is a very bad thing in the police world.

fubar

7535 Posts
12/09
Posted - Jun 30 2014 : 10:26PM
There are various terms to describe the process: self-fulfilling prophecy, feedback circle, etc. So many people don't respect cops because so many cops don't deserve respect. However that process ends, the body count will be high.
 
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Posted - Jul 1 2014 : 12:14AM
 
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Woman of the Decade
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Posted - Jul 1 2014 : 12:53AM
, Kimi:
You are absolutely correct the both of you. She was in the wrong.
But -- and I'm just spitballing here -- maybe, perhaps, possibly, the very fact that one is a police officer, should prompt one to sometimes, every now and then, expect that they will encounter such difficult people. So we can either tase a new person nightly --- OR -- instead of exacerbating the situation, perhaps the psychological approach, (especially when you've got two or more officers around) is far more advantageous, to the officer. The "twenty questions" approach -- admittedly perhaps not as satisfying as a left hook -- wears down the antagonist to the point where their own anger is folding in on them. Sure they might get more belligerent, but by that time, backup can be arranged and if there is a video camera present, there is now proof that the defendant basically hung themselves with their own rope.
That's really what this thread is about -- if you're wearing a law enforcement uniform, you're kind of supposed to be prepared for difficult situations and difficult people. You're supposed to be the "Adult In The Room" as it were. You're supposed to be able to take control of situations and defuse them when possible. Every situation -- especially ones involving unarmed individuals -- does not call for the Harry Callahan approach.
If we're just going to tolerate cops throwing punches, and tazing and shooting people, then why even have a police department or an academy at all? Why not just put up ads on Craigslist?

Wanted: Policeman.
Requirements:
1) Must have seen at least a few episodes of "The Wire"
2) You've dreamt about doing this since you were five.
3) High School Diploma
If interested, called 800-555-3426. Leave a message and someone will get back to you.
And calm down bro, we're not all hardcore about #3.

 
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Posted - Jul 1 2014 : 12:55AM
littering.PNG

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Posted - Jul 1 2014 : 1:36AM
Let me say, I agree with you 100%. But more than likely that's just not going to happen. By law citizen's have to obey police officers....they know this. "I'm a police officer, this person should be obeying me"....It's not that cops CAN'T deescalate a situation that's gotten out of hand by talking. It's simply not required by law and at that point they don't have to. Nor do I think they would want to.
Why? Police officers suffer from the same stress and anger that everyone else does. If they find their authority challenged, you will almost always end up with situations like this.
 
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Woman of the Decade
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Posted - Jul 1 2014 : 2:14AM
^
Well, recognition of ones' civil rights IS required by law. Again, cops do themselves a favor when they let the suspect become a victim of their own asshole-ness. Let the suspect play the game of "you can't disrespect me like that you fascist!!" The officer is supposed to be above that.
He orders the guy to pick up the ripped tickets, but otherwise is content just to let him have his meltdown. Sure, 90% of the people who view this clip say "If I was him, I'd have decked his ass good."
And that 90% is just the type who DON'T need to be police officers.


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Posted - Jul 1 2014 : 9:24AM
^ Agreed. And I remember watching that video a long time ago.
 
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Posted - Jul 1 2014 : 11:16AM
And again, let me stress, this is dealing with UNARMED individuals.
Once a suspect has been acknowledged as not possessing a weapon the ultimate balance of power rests in the hands of the officer.
 
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Posted - Jul 4 2014 : 12:37PM

Details are sketchy at this time.
Well, except for the punching. That pretty much definitely happened.

Senior Member

3520 Posts
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Posted - Jul 4 2014 : 5:14PM
I agree that you should not push your luck with an officer. However, the remark that rights are what you have after you call your attorney is misleading. Assuming the cop isn't holding a billy club to your back or a pistol to your head you should never incriminate yourself before discussing it with your attorney (and in the US and Canada actually have the right to stop all questioning at any time). If a cop is threatening excessive force in order to get a confession out of you I cannot honestly say what you should do but even then if you incriminate yourself more than likely you are going to prison hell. Even if you are guilty pleading not guilty (which you have the right to do and won't be charged with perjury (in either the US or Canada) for doing so even if you are actually "guilty as hell") until your attorney says to do otherwise will likely get you a lesser fine, lower prison/jail sentence and lesser probation/parole time. It may also turn a felony into a misdemeanor via plea bargaining which preserves your future civil rights. It may also get you off scot free if there is a problem with the case, usually on Constitutional/Charter grounds (again, in the US or Canada) or lack of evidence. I understand that in the Netherlands a person's rights once arrested are similar to the US but never having lived there myself I can't say how that bares out in practice. If Jacco sees this he may be able to expound on that issue. If you are not in one of those three countries guard your nuts because if arrested you may be in for a serious beating, especially in a Communist or third-world country.
 
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Posted - Jul 4 2014 : 6:22PM
Chuck Norris would like a word. My cousin's son holds a black belt in karate. He looks more a bookworm than a fighter but, in fact, he's so good that the master has him teach at the dojo. Looks can be deceiving.
Once a suspect has been acknowledged as not possessing a weapon...
Exactly how do you envision that happening?

Senior Member

2116 Posts
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Posted - Jul 4 2014 : 6:41PM
I'm happy to say most of these stories seem to originate outside of the northeast. In the Boston-New York area to become a cop;
Pass comprehensive written test containing literacy, reading, logic, deductive reasoning and math.
Pass an oral exam administered by usually between 3 to 5 higher ranking cops.
Comply with a restrictive tattoo/scarification policy.
Pass a physical agility test
Have between a two or four year college degree depending upon the agency.
Pass a lengthy background investigation.
Pass a credit check
Pass a psychological exam and an interview with a psychiatrist
Pass a physician's physical exam
Pass a one on one interview with an administrative officer.
Complete the academy curriculum
Complete a field training practicum and be given the green light by another officer who be called to task during the first year his trainee is working
Complete usually a one year probationary period
Pass a final interview at the end of his or her probationary period.
Be subject to random drug and alcohol and tobacco screening ( even smoking off duty is prohibited)
Annually comply with physical performance standards
Annually complete a state specified number of hours of training in specific areas.
In addition, many departments require a master's degree in order to be eligible for promotion beyond the rank of sergeant.
This sure doesn't eliminate all the problems but it sure doesn't seem to hurt...

fubar

7535 Posts
12/09
Posted - Jul 4 2014 : 7:14PM
^And yet, cops shooting massive quantities of bullets at unarmed innocent people happens in NYC as much as anywhere else.
 
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Posted - Jul 4 2014 : 8:09PM
^ That's a pretty comprehensive claim. Where are you getting your data from?

fubar

7535 Posts
12/09
Posted - Jul 4 2014 : 8:50PM

The legal standards of police brutality vary by city, county, state, and all divisions and borders of government.
 
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Posted - Jul 4 2014 : 10:05PM
The article your link takes me to is National data on shootings by police not collected. That's not helping.
 
Golden Age Classic

13508 Posts
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Posted - Jul 5 2014 : 9:12AM
Where did your information come from or was it just a guess?
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